Zuko and
Katara do represent yin and yang in the show. It’s apparent not only by their
first fight in the Siege of the North:
Zuko: You rise with the moon. I rise with the sun.
But because “Siege of the North” is overlaid with other yin and yang imagery; namely the koi
fish:
And, just for extra emphasis, Koh spells it out for us:
Koh: Tui and La, your Moon and Ocean, have always circled each other in an eternal dance. They balance each other… push and pull… life and death… good and evil… yin… and yang.
However, it is important to understand that representing yin and
yang does not mean that they can’t be similar. As Koh
says: they balance each other. They are equals.
Zuko is darkness with a hidden light:
Katara is light with a hidden darkness:
They share similar belief systems and parallel pasts, but they come
from nations on the opposite side of the world. They both have tempers, but
Zuko tends to let his show on the outside, while Katara’s anger is quieter, but
she carries it longer. They both become surrogate parents for Aang, but their
parenting styles are entirely different.
Zuko and Katara are the same idea, expressed in opposite ways.
acciozutara asked:
Forgetting the comics, what do you think Katara and Zuko would have done at the end of book 3? Do you think Zuko and Katara would have gone to the Southern Water Tribe together or stated in the Fire Nation together? Or do you think they would have gone their separate ways? I feel like Karara would have needed to go back home to try and rebuild her tribe, but I can't see her feeling happy staying there very long. I'm super interested for your thoughts, and I love all of your analysis!
I think Katara would have
spent a couple of weeks in the palace, healing Zuko as only she could (since
there would be no other water healers on hand) and at the same time, making
good use of the vast information available at her hands to expand her healing
arsenal. She would probably ask about psychological illnesses, too, since she
would feel partly responsible for what happened with Azula. At that point, a
very grumpy Zuko would inform her that she can’t take on everything herself, so he will study up on the psychological
manuals while she deals with the physical. In the process, he would have a few
revelations along the way about what happened to him and his sister in their
childhood, and how they can better recover.
Meanwhile, the palace would
have to be renovated and power not only consolidated, but held as Ozai’s
bullies and yes-men get flushed from the Fire Nation capital. Iroh would
definitely have his work cut out for him as Zuko recovers, and he and his
nephew would have to work out a plan for co-ruling, with Iroh gradually
transferring more power to Zuko as he grows into his own. When the plan is
finalized, Katara knows she needs to go home, and feels a pang of regret,
without knowing exactly why this affects her so much. Zuko knows, deep down,
that he is in love with her, but refuses to admit it to himself because doing
so would be too painful. (It’s not like he could ask her to stay, after all
she’s done for him.) So, avoiding Uncle’s knowing looks, the two would bid each
other a fond good-bye, complete with a lingering hug and promise to write each
other. Katara would set sail for the Southern Water Tribe and prepare for the
monumental task of rebuilding.
It would take several years
before they spent a long amount of time together—there’s too much for both of
them to do in their respective nations, and the voyage back and forth takes
time. But there are reunion parties with the GAang, and treaties to negotiate,
and refugees to settle, and international crises of one kind or another. And
Katara does have another solo adventure with Zuko when she journeys with him to
find out what happened to his mother. (Hint: it’s not what happened to Ursa in
the comics. Because that was stupid.)
Katara and Sokka would
package their letters to Zuko with dried jerky, hand-sewn ornaments, and
“artistic” carvings that find their way in no matter how much Katara protests.
Because when Sokka points out she spends more time on her hand-sewn gifts than
he spends on the carvings, she blushes as violently as she defends herself.
Sokka and Hakoda have a man-to-man talk about whether Zuko is good enough for
Katara, and they both agree that he is, and also that it wouldn’t really matter
because Katara wouldn’t let either of them have a say anyway. So the next
series of correspondence includes an official letter from the chief to host a
Very Important Ceremony for the Firelord. For purely political reasons.
Zuko, at this point, would be
up to his ears in marriage offers, and Katara would be fending suitors off with an
ice pick. The difference is, Katara would also be contending with the sexism
trickling south from the Northern Water Tribe, and one day, she would
realize how much she is still invested in providing for everybody else at her
expense. Uncle also fears that Zuko is giving too much of himself to the job,
and not leaving any room to be himself. The position of Firelord is too much
for one person to take on, and the position of chief’s daughter doesn’t offer
enough for Katara’s talents. Uncle would tactfully hint at this fact to Hakoda,
who would ask why Zuko doesn’t do something about it then. Uncle just sighs and
says Zuko thinks he has too much to lose by trying. However, Zuko surprises
everyone by accepting Katara as a Water Tribe ambassador in front of everyone—a
position that no one knew she’d applied for and that she didn’t think she’d
get (as she has to be approved by several Fire Nation diplomats as well). Her job will be to establish a permanent outpost of waterbenders in the
Fire Nation so that the diplomats, royalty, sailors, and traders have a
miniature community of their own to call home.
It won’t be until another
catastrophe, another back-to-back fight, and another reunion in Ba Sing Se takes place that Katara and Zuko finally find their way to each other
romantically. There will have been dinners, and plans, and long walks on the
beach at Ember Island in the intervening months, but neither of them willing to admit what it means for them. Now, ten years on, they realize how much time has passed, and how short
life really is now that they’re no longer teenagers. When the GAang say their
goodbyes this time, Sokka goes back to the Water Tribe alone, and Zuko asks
Katara to stay at the palace. They will marry within the year, and spend the
rest of their lives toppling every single wrong idea about their marriage, their identities, and whether their nations can heal.
Anonymous asked:
Sorry that this is more commentary than a question, but your recent Azula posts got me thinking. I’m glad some people understand that both predisposition AND circumstances shaped her into who she was. Both her apologists and her lynchmob fail titanically in grasping this. In their minds, it’s impossible to simultaneously be tormented and a tormentor. That’s bull crap. It’s one of the many reasons I wish Aaron got his fourth season, because he could've done a great job further developing this.
It’s been a wild weekend, hasn’t it, readers? From the debut of “The Dragon Prince” to the accolades it obtained, to its huge popularity in the A:TLA fandom and the rise of Aaron Ehasz to the fame he’s deserved for over a decade!
But hold onto your hats, because it’s going to get even wilder.
First, I would like to thank a few people. To the anon who sent in another Book 4 ask which overlaps with this answer:
I was wondering, do you think there should have been an ATLA Book 4? If so, do you think there would have been time for Zutara to unfold? I would have loved to have a book 4, but my boyfriend thinks there wouldn’t have been enough plot to drive it now that Ozai is in prison, and I guess I get his point. Do you think a book 4 would have just felt like a tack-on season?
To @durgonpranz, for giving me the links to this information.
I know, I know, this is all just a theory, right? Some tumblr users claiming to have worked on the show supposedly told us all the things he said he would like to explore; so what? Heck, even I labeled all Book 4 theories as “speculation” in my Greatest Hits page. Until now.
Hmm, the trail of links continues! But could this poster be trusted? Well, as it turns out, this woman is a writer for “The Dragon Prince”: https://mobile.twitter.com/devongiehl
So, confirmed: this reddit user “ehasz” IS the real Ehasz, according to one of his own coworkers. There’s a whole lot of interesting stuff in that link, but I’m going to share the meat of it. From here, emphasis mine:
I was head writer of ATLA. Azula and Zuko’s relationship was not always well understood, even by the team internally. Azula loved Zuko, more than anyone save her father. She also felt competitive with him for their parents’ attention of course, but since she had alienated herself from her mother, she focused her energy on pleasing dad… which of course meant acting in more and more intense and possibly evil ways. By the end of the series, of course, her loss of her friends shatters the part of her identity that she could somehow control affection and love through intimidation. As a result she spirals… I did however intend to leave a kernel of humanity, and had we made a season 4 Azula would have completely bottomed and we would have explored the possibility of a path to redemption. True story! -Aaron
So there you have it. Not all the people who worked on A:TLA got the complexity of Azula and Zuko’s relationship; Azula loved Zuko; her alienation from her mother was her own doing; and oh yes, Azula’s redemption would have been explored had they made a season 4.
Ehasz is a writer, so he chooses his words carefully. He doesn’t say “may have explored”, but “would have explored.” This means he had been planning the fourth season, not just as a flight of fancy, but as a concrete addition to the franchise including specific ideas. And no matter how many times Bryke insist that there was always a specific number of episodes and a finite number of seasons, it’s hard to see a head writer planning ideas for a season that has no chance of moving forward.
Book 4 never saw film; it never even saw production. But it did exist, and still does, in the mind of Avatar’s most influential writer. (I suspect, with “The Dragon Prince,” we’re seeing it.)
Goodnight, everyone!
zeroxz21 asked:
Wait... there was a REAL announcement for a live action Avatar? Can't help but feel a bit sketchy at the timing of this, what with the Dragon Prince having just come out and everyone going on about that. Can't help but think, after the apparent, uh, conflicts between Ehasz & Bryke, that this also is a way for Bryke to reclaim/remake Avatar in their own image, as it were. It'll be interesting to see what exactly that is, though I absolutely expect it to be inferior to the original series.
Oh and did everyone just forget how well live action Avatar turned out the first time?
This is the first and only question I will answer about this series, because I am not going to give Bryke the attention that they so obviously crave.
Let’s not kid ourselves: this is a political move. They made a press release for their own Netflix show less than a week after their former coworker’s show premiered on Netflix, about which they did not say one word.
And no, it won’t be interesting to see what Avatar in their own image would be like, because we already know what would have happened if it were just the two of them with protection from the editors.
“When we pitched the show, we imagined that Aang was ten, Katara was twelve, and Sokka was thirteen. Upon Eric Coleman’s suggestion, we aged them up a couple years during the development process.”
“It wasn’t until the premiere episodes that we thought the story would be more interesting if Zuko’s sifu was actually his uncle, though his personality didn’t evolve much. It was Aaron Ehasz who brought a softer side to the writing of Uncle’s character.”
“During the bible development, Bryan and I conceived of Toph as a tough, brash, blind teenage boy who would become Aang’s Earthbending teacher. As we began the writing for season two, Aaron Ehasz suggested making Toph a girl. Bryan and I resisted the idea at first … Now, I can’t imagine Toph any other way.”
“Azula’s design came together relatively quickly, compared to other main characters in Avatar. Aaron Ehasz and the writers were really great at making her cunning and sadistically manipulative, and Grey DeLisle played her brilliantly. As a result, I think she was by far the most complex, interesting, and dangerous villain in the series.”
—Michael Dante DiMartino, Bryan Konietzko, The Art of the Animated Series
Bryke, I do not believe in “your vision” for a live-action movie. I have no confidence, based on a full decade of your post-A:TLA work, you will “build upon everyone’s great work on the original animated series and go even deeper into the characters, story, action, and world-building.” And readers, deep down, you know this live-action series won’t give you what you want. It will not give you that feeling back that you had when you first watched the show. This is Azula, trying to distract you and waste all your time. Ignore it. If you’re tempted to voice your irritation, redirect your energy into a work that could use more attention.
Anonymous asked:
What's your response to this argument I saw one time saying that anti/aang rhetoric fails to take into account how aang never acts jealous or possessive of katara in the episode "jet" where she exudes outward feelings for another guy in front of him? I've always had this question myself, wasn't sure if it was something used to make the plot go smoothly or not. Like if both sokka and aang didn't like jet, then Katara would've been swayed to leave way earlier n the episode wouldn't have happened.
I actually agree with that point: Aang doesn’t act jealous or possessive at all, even when Katara’s crush on Jet is obvious. He even wears the hat that Katara made for Jet!
Throughout season one, actually, Aang’s feelings for Katara are handled well. He’s kind and tender, and whether Katara wants to mack on Jet or Haru, he’s helpful in whatever cause her romantic interests are pursuing.
He has a crush from the start:
He thinks she’s pretty:
He pursues her:
But, it doesn’t interfere with the foundation of his character.
In fact, with the exception of The Fortuneteller [You can read my opinions on this episode here [x] & [x], Basically, the episode focuses on learning about one-sided crushes, only to take the last 20s and reduce Katara’s destiny to who she’s going to end up marrying]... Anyways, with the exception of last 20s of The Fortuneteller, season one did a splendid job of shaping Aang’s feelings for Katara into something that was ultimately one-sided:
But, it was still innocent and cute.
In fact, I didn’t dislike Kataang until the end of season two and all of season three.
In season two, my issues came with Aang’s choice to choose Katara over the Avatar State. It was foolish on his part, and a foolhardy push by the creators to show us just how much Aang loved Katara.
It was silly, considering season two was full of instances that not only foreshadowed Aang growing out of his crush on Katara:
But also, further established their relationship as one-sided:
Katara: [Turns to face him and gestures to the portrait.] And here, it says, “Love is brightest in the dark,” and has a picture of them kissing. Aang: [Utterly confused and lost.] Where are you going with this? Katara: [Shyly, blushing.] Well, what if we … kissed? Aang: [Very surprised.] Us … kissing? Katara: See? It was a crazy idea. Aang: [Dreamily.] Us … kissing … Katara: [Fake-jokingly.] Us kissing. What was I thinking? Can you imagine that?
And
Aang: They’re made of some kind of crystal. They must only light up in the dark. Katara: That’s how the two lovers found each other. [Gestures with her hand along the ceiling.] They just put out their lights and followed the crystals. [Sees the exit.] That must be the way out! [The two hug.] Aang: So, uh … Katara: Let’s go!
The ending of season two also dashed a ton of character development for Aang, such as learning a bending stye so unlike his own:
Navigating struggles between himself and his masters:
And learning that his way of life may not be the only ‘right’ way of life:
Aang’s decision in The Crossroads of Destiny didn’t align with the development in season two, and seemed an awfully rash decision considering we’d only ever seen Katara behave maternally around Aang. A narrative that is only furthered by the illusion to Pieta:
In season three, Aang’s behavior grew into something that was no longer innocent and one-sided, but aggressive and one-sided:
Aang: [Standing up.] Argh! Katara: Relax, Aang. They’re not accurate portrayals. It’s not like I’m a preachy crybaby who can’t resist giving overemotional speeches about hope all the time. [Everyone looks at her.] What? Aang: [Turns around and sits down. Sarcastically.] Yeah, that’s not you at all.
Katara: Are you all right? Aang: [Angered.] No, I’m not! I hate this play! [Yanks his hat off and throws it on the ground.] Katara: I know it’s upsetting, but it sounds like you’re overreacting. Aang: Overreacting? If I hadn’t blocked my chakra, I’d probably be in the Avatar State right now!
Aang: Katara, did you really mean what you said in there? Katara: In where? What are you talking about? Aang: On stage, when you said I was just like a … brother to you, and you didn’t have feelings for me. Katara: I didn’t say that. An actor said that. Aang: But it’s true, isn’t it? We kissed at the Invasion, and I thought we were gonna be together. But we’re not. Katara: Aang, I don’t know. Aang: Why don’t you know? KataraBecause, we’re in the middle of a war, and, we have other things to worry about. This isn’t the right time. Aang: Well, when is the right time? Katara: Aang, I’m sorry, but right now I’m just a little confused.
Katara: I just said I was confused! I’m going inside. [Exits the balcony.]
Not only that, but their relationship, based on dialogue alone (X & X), was drifting apart. Aang was increasingly belligerent and self-righteous, while Katara was treated as a means-to-an-end, his muse, his reason for saving the world, and his prize for succeeding.
*nods*
You see, Aang may not have shown possessive tendencies in season one or two, because the relationship was handled properly. However, the moment Kataang became so forced as to neglect Aang’s character development in season two and portray poor behavior as romantic in season three, Aang does act possessive and aggressive towards Katara.
And because he’s never taught that his actions are wrong, because he never apologizes for the many times he acted out towards Katara, Kataang is tainted by these negative qualities, and the pattern continues on into the comics and LOK.
(*Number one is without a doubt “The Ember Island Players“, number two or three, depending on my mood is “The Southern Raiders”)
Like, it’s an episode that dedicates 22 minutes and 43 seconds of it’s 22 minute and 59 second run-time to showing the audience how Aang’s crush is jut that: a crush.
It isn’t even subtle about it:
Her name is Meng, which is phonetically nearly identical to Aang, AS THE SHOW ACTUALLY TAKES TIME TO POINT OUT TO YOU (“That rhymes with Meng!“) and she’s two years younger then the object of her affection.
THIS IS NOT A SUBTLE PARALLEL PEOPLE
Like, it all but rubs in our faces how it’s superficial:
(It even plays the same music.)
Then it has them using the same technique in an attempt to flirt:
Meng: “Hey, Aang. Don’t you think that cloud looks like a flower?”
Aang: “Hey, Katara, don’t you think that cloud look like a flower?”
And getting dismissed.
Then the object of their affections shows complete and utter disinterest:
(Because, they aren’t actually interested at all.)
And so on.
And then this happens:
Meng: “You don’t like me, do you?”
Aang:
“Of course I like you.“
Meng: “But not the way I like you.”
Aang:
“Oh, I guess not.”
Meng:
“It’s okay. It’s just really hard when you like someone, but they don’t think of you that way.”
Aang: “I know what you mean.” Meng: “She’s beautiful, by the way.”
Aang:
“Huh?”
Meng: “That Water Tribe girl. I can see why you like her so much. She’s sweet, she’s a bender and her hair seems so manageable.”
Aang:
“Don’t worry. You’re going to meet a great guy who’s going to completely fall for you. I know it.”
And it’s just… such a GOOD and PURE scene? and such a good message to send to children?
“You don’t like me the way i like you and, while it’s hard for me, that’s okay.“ What a wonderful thing to put in a children’s cartoon! Especially considering that we live in a world where “first-love-is-forever” is the norm.
I thought that those 16 seconds where Katara actually seems to consider him in a romantic light were there just so that they could milk the will-they-won’t-they for all it’s worth. I thought that there was just no way anyone could spend all that time telling one story, sending one message only to completely disregard it in the end. (aaand looooooool @mini-me what a fool i was, chakra opening rock anyone?)
Like, honestly, the first time i watched this episode I was completely convinced that this scene was foreshadowing the ultimate resolution of Aang’s crush on Katara: Aang realising that it’s one-sided and displaying emotional maturity and self-awareness.And giving his blessing for Katara to pursue other people.
Instead, the poor boy regresses completely, forces a kiss on her and is then rewarded for it by the narrative.
Now I’m going to discuss a different aspect about the infamous chakra plot hole that deserves its own post. One of the most aggravating things about the Book 3 finale for me was the way it absolutely butchered the metaphysical component of the Avatar State and the chakras. As well as the meaning of the Crown Chakra. I’ve seen Kataang fans come up with different theories or explanations for why it’s not a plot hole or Deus Ex Machina, but I vehemently disagree with their interpretations, for reasons I’ll explain. Let’s start with this scene.
This scene is very important. The reason that all of that energy is twisted up in Aang’s back, is because he was midway through activating his kundalini. While in the Crystal Catacombs, Aang was meditating, and trying to let Katara go. Although he didn’t quite understand it at the moment, his selfless desire to put his own feelings aside to master the Avatar State in order to protect Katara, was exactly what allowed him to temporarily enter the Avatar State. That is exactly what the Guru meant when he said to be detached. Putting your needs aside to protect others.
The kundalini is an energetic coil located at the base of the spine, said to be shaped like twisted serpents. While meditating, the spiritual energy rises through each Chakra, and eventually reaches the Crown Chakra. Once the Crown Chakra is activated, it connects your consciousness to the spiritual realms. Essentially, you connect to the Divine, and see reality in an entirely different manner. You see that all sentient life is connected to the same Source, and we are all One. This helps you transcend the bounds of the ego, and become capable of extreme acts of altruism and selflessness.
The energy in the kundalini is NOT physical. It is not something that you can just send through you by physical force. It only happens when your consciousness reaches a certain state, through meditation or some other significant event in your life. Mike and Bryan will never, ever, EVER be able to come up with an explanation that isn’t complete bullshit for this scene and how it happened. Because there is none.
In fact, Zuko’s entire illness during The Earth King, was a result of this very process; just one more of Aang and Zuko’s many parallels. His selfless decision to let Appa go put him into a position he didn’t expect. It triggered certain aspects of his consciousness that he had repressed, and prematurely activated his kundalini. He quite simply was not ready for all that energy. Premature kundalini activation is said to cause physical illness, and altered states of consciousness. Zuko’s fever and bizarre nightmares and
psychedelic
phenomenon are entirely consistent with kundalini energy associated with rising consciousness. However…
Once the kundalini is able to open the Crown Chakra, your consciousness is expanded, and you are never able to experience life the same way again. You experience a state of bliss called Samadhi, and you recognize your true spiritual nature, as well as everyone else’s in relation to you. You will never be the same person again. It’s a brand new way, permanent way of experiencing reality.
After this process, you experience heightened emotions and empathy. Previously repressed emotions all come to the surface and you experience your emotions and the emotions of others much more intensely than ever.
The reason that Aang received a vision of Katara was because he activated his 6th chakra, the Third Eye Chakra. The Third Eye Chakra is located in the pineal gland at the center of the forehead and is said to be the gateway to telepathy, clairvoiyance, and other psychic phenomena.
Aang needed to “let Katara go” because she was his remaining earthly attachment. Not because he cared about her, but because his attachment was selfish. Attachments are things you want for yourself that interfere with loving others properly. He has an expectation for Katara to reward him with her affections when he saves the world, even though she seems uninterested in him romantically. He needed to let go of the expectation for a reward to access his spirituality.
For Aang to open this chakra fair and square, he would have had to give up the attachment to his desire for the girl he likes to reward him later with her affections. He needs to pursue the highest good with no expectation for a reward. There was one other attachment that Aang had.
Aang was very committed to his philosophy of respecting all life. He felt so strongly about it that he even condemned Katara for her justifiable rage and hate she had for Yon Rha.
But as Yangchen tells him, he needs to be able to set aside his personal feelings in order to do what is best for the world. It was his attachment to the idea of himself as pure and untainted that was his other stumbling block. He would have needed to come to the realization that his own feelings about killing don’t matter and let that go.
Ironically, it would have been that very selfless choice to sacrifice his own morals temporarily that would have allowed him to spare Ozai’s life. If he opened his chakra and connected his consciousness to the cosmic energy, he’d master the Avatar State and be able to energybend.
At that point the meaning of being the “bridge between the human world and spirit world” would be literal and figurative. He can travel there astrally, and also be the bridge between the human world and the spiritual values of selfless love from the spiritual realm. Like Yangchen said, the Avatar can never disconnect from the world. That is his purpose. To be the bridge and bring balance to the world by serving its people selflessly.
There is no way to reconcile any of this with the canon ending. Quite simply, it makes no sense and it defies all logic and common sense that it was planned this way from the start. Aang never opened his final chakra. Period.
“If we had another season then there would be more stuff about Iroh’s past” - Ehasz wanted to write a two-part flashback episode about Iroh’s transformation into the person he is today. It would feature the siege of Ba Sing Se, Lu Ten’s death, and his travels around both the mortal and spirit world.
“Toph fixing her own issues” - Toph learns to heal from the emotional abuse she endured from her parents and repairs their relationship. She needed some character development when it came to mellowing out her harsh personality. Katara’s motherly influence helped her but Toph needed to deal with the direct cause. Ehasz loves Toph (he basically created her) and was upset that she remained so static throughout the series.
“I wanted to develop this subtle romance between two of the main characters but I don’t think Mike and Bryan would have been too happy about that.” - It’s pretty obvious what couple he is talking about with this line. Ehasz always wanted to make Zuko/Katara canon or at least develop it much more than what was shown in the actual series, but Bryke would fight with him about it. This was why the chance of Katara ending up with either Zuko or Aang was 50-50 even mid-way through the third season. Yes, this means the “Zuko was originally going to be the love interest for Katara” and “The writers and creators toyed with the idea of Zuko and Katara falling in love” Avatar Extras are completely true. The cancellation of the fourth season and Shyamalan’s complaints about how indecisive Bryke were about who Katara was going to end up with led the Nick execs to step in and push for Katara/Aang because that was what they concluded as being most suitable for young children. The resulting draft for the finale ended up with Katara/Aang and lot of people in the writing room were surprised since they believed Zuko/Katara was the better choice. Bryke wanted Katara and Aang to passionately kiss to symbolize a marriage and make them look “definite”. This is in contrast with Ehasz who just wanted a sweet scene near the end where Zuko and Katara talked about how much the world had changed to foreshadow a future between them.
I totally buy all of this: I actually met Ehasz two years ago. Let me preface this by saying I have the upmost respect for him, and he’s an awesome person.
I had the chonies to ask him what he thought about LoK and the ATLA comics. He was very kind in his criticisms, and pretty much said the same exact things you have mentioned above about ATLA. Its funny too how his honesty keeps dispelling all of the claims Bryke have made about various things.
Zutura is definitely a ship that invokes a lot of passion on both sides, but I honestly think if Ehasz were in charge of developing it further, it would have been executed quite nicely and really brought forth some interesting topics and themes during the hypothetical fourth season.
It really, really makes me wish Ehasz was involved in writing the comics. Can you imagine how improved they would be?
Hey, thanks for your input! I am a former Nicktern and I knew of this stuff for years. People tended to brush me off whenever I told them info about it because according to them “Bryke’s word is law”. The bitter Kataangers love to pounce on me for being ~delusional~ because Bryke is on their side. But they don’t seem to realize how dishonest they are and that Legend of Korra carries a huge collection of Bryke’s lies. Everything I say is just what I witnessed while working at Nick or a repeat of everything Ehasz has already said. Heck, Ehasz has told numerous people the same thing and even hosted a lecture at UCB about the Avatar stuff he didn’t get a chance to write about. I never liked Kataang but I didn’t ship Zutara until I heard about all the unexplored potential. Regardless of whatever ship would become canon, I definitely think the comics would have worked better if he was writing them. May I ask what Ehasz told you by the way? I never got to ask him exactly what he thought about LoK.
Oh dang, former intern? That must have been a pretty cool experience. My other fandom is LoZ and I’m dead serious when I say I’d give an arm and a leg to be involved in making a LoZ game. I love ATLA though just as much.
Something I noticed about this fandom is that when people disagree with you, they tend to pounce on you and shriek that their ship/character is better and that you are wrong. Problem is, instead of having a healthy debate that could be constructive, it involves name calling and no evidence. I’m a firm believer that you should ship what you want and like the characters you want to like, and not be ridiculed for it. Disagree, but don’t put others down.
Ehasz and I mostly talked (and when I say talked, like 5 minutes max) about the comics and ATLA, but he did talk a little about LoK. The thing he stressed was about his vision being ‘different than Bryke’s,’ and stated what he would have done differently. His approach to criticism is clearly different than Bryke’s, and it actually mirrors the way they write. Bryke is more in your face and telling, whereas Ehasz is more subtle and showing. Bryke gets defensive over criticism and makes excuses, Ehasz accepts criticism and says what he could have done differently; its a fixed versus a growth mindset.
But anyways, here’s a summary of what he told me. Sadly, I met him before the Book 4 premiere, so I couldn’t tell you his thoughts on Korrasami. I would imagine though, given the way he handles relationships, it wouldn’t have been favorable. This is what I recall about Lok:
Thought overall they did a good job, but didn’t agree with all of their choices. Would have preferred a post-ATLA series featuring the Gaang, and if allowed to do both, do the post-ATLA before LoK. This way, it would bridge the gap better and fill in loose gaps (see below).
Was a little surprised by the way Aang’s adulthood was portrayed, and would have changed his characterization a bit. Was also surprised by the lack of Sokka and would have increased his role. Would give readers some information on side characters such as Mai, Suki, etc., and what happened to them. But that’s also due to his ideas for the comics.
Liked Korra’s character, but would have handled the romantic relationships differently. Specifically referenced the love triangle and wouldn’t do that. Wasn’t sure he would permanently keep the Spirit Portals opened. Also liked the equalist movement and would do more with that. Red Lotus was cool but surprised by air bending abilities due to HC. Was interested at the time to see more of Kuvira.
Mentioned that ship Bryke doesn’t care for, and would have explored this relationship in both post-ATLA and LoK, and potential consequences such as political stuff. We had a good laugh about that one. Giving more info and exploration about post-war Fire Nation was what he hoped Book 4 would do.
Asked about his thoughts on Toph’s portrayal (I don’t hold back, heh) and said his vision was different. Didn’t outright say he hated or disliked it, but definitely that his vision was different and wanted to touch on her overcoming her issues with parents before LoK and having positive but realistic relationship with own kids. Would have handled Suyin and Lin differently (felt it was the wrong direction).
Similar to his ATLA commentary on Iroh, would have explored more of Iroh’s influence on Zuko and Spirit World. More Gaang interaction during LoK events would have been nice. Katara in regards to healing and bloodbending would be altered- agreed she would be against bloodbending but liked to see her fight still.
Based on the number of times he said ‘my vision was different,’ I am completely convinced that’s Ehasz’s way of shading the hell out of Bryke. Either way, he’s an awesome mind to pick. He knows his stuff and the work he and his wife do speaks for itself.
I don’t really know about Ehasz’s opinions on Korra because I haven’t spoken to him in ages (approximately 4 years now) and the show had just finished it’s first season at the time. Haha, it’s not hard getting an internship at Nickelodeon. They’re not strict and they accepted me on my first attempt. You just have to be a university student with a lot of motivation.
Before ATLA had ended and the possibility of a Book 4 was still up in the air, he said he wanted to explore the political side of their world (and airbenders would have been hiding in the Fire Nation instead of being the result of Harmonic Convergence!). After ATLA ended, Ehasz said Bryke wanted him to make a spin-off focusing on Katara/Aang’s children which would have bridged the gap between ATLA and LoK (instead of releasing comics). The first option would have been the best and the second might have still been better than what we eventually got.
Glad you mentioned the showing vs. telling thing with Ehasz vs. Bryke because this impacted on how they wrote the Kataang relationship. Sometimes it was a cutesy ship tease thing by Ehasz and sometimes it was a forced mess on near-Makorra levels of bad by Bryke (which the other writers had to tone down). Ehasz is probably mad at the current direction of the Avatar franchise but he has to keep it to himself because he’s not the creator and he’s still a good friend of Bryke’s.
Thanks for the info! It links up to a lot of stuff I have discussed before. I’m all ears if you ever want to go into detail about the what-could-have-been you discussed with Ehasz.
I’m honestly not a fan of K/ataang, but if Ehasz had been the one to develop it I have no doubt that even I would start shipping it. A lot of Bryke’s writing is really messy and rushed, and full of unnecessary plot twists that absolutely make no sense at all. I’ve mentioned this before too, but f you look at the list of ATLA episodes, you’d see that the best ones that really just strike you are the ones written by either Ehasz or his wife.
Not sure if I could rely on the information re: Bryke’s reaction to criticism and subtlety, cus we’d never really know unless someone posts links to videos or interviews of them actually being defensive; but if this really is the case, I feel it’d really do them well if they take note that in the principles of writing, a “show not tell” style is always a boost. As in Kataang, anyone can take a couple and make them kiss in front of you with an orchestra to back it up. But it’s how those two characters were developed and how their adversities (and how they overcome it, if ever) that count.
Maybe it could work, but it still wouldn’t erase the fact that Kataang was a half-assed mess throughout all of the original series.
You’ve seriously never seen Bryke being defensive? Let me shed some light on this…
“It’s funny there are people who are so attached to the original series and it’s funny because when they confront us and they write us critical things like they’ll write us a little fan letter like… Mike and I remember during Avatar how people would be like ‘I don’t like this, and kind of whining about every little thing in the show, and really mad about how a season finale would end, and ‘I can’t believe you’d put the characters through that,’ and now that years have been removed from that, the feedback we get now about Avatar is like, ‘It’s perfect, there is nothing wrong with it, and every moment of it is perfect,’ and I don’t think every moment is perfect, I have tons of problems throughout the series, but I love it and I’m proud of it. And then with Korra they’re nitpicking every little thing and there’s a lot of comparing of Korra to, not just the shows, but comparing the character of Korra to Aang like ‘Aang was such a sweet, gentle soul, and Korra is just, she’s awful!’ …I always think back at New York Comic Con, it was at a point early in Book 2 where Korra was kind of going off the rails, and I remember Mike and the writers really wanted this civil war, she’s gonna take it very personally and it’s gonna cloud her judgement, and she’s not making good decisions. And people really didn’t like it, and I remember being interviewed in New York and they were like, ‘People hate Korra… so why did you do it?’ And I was like wow, and like, Aang was like going on a rampage in the middle of the desert beating people up because someone took his bison.”
“It seems to me that people are uninterested in that. They get completely angry when we have fun with the teen romance stuff. I don’t know. I’m going to leave that alone. This is my new theory. Fans are more interested in imagining relationships between a myriad of pairings. But they’re profoundly disinterested in seeing any of those things manifest themselves on the show. So who knows, whatever. Mike and I as writers, we wrote it the way we found it to be entertaining, and that struck a chord with some, but maybe not with some others.”
Bryan Konietzko creates a webcomic which presents all critics of his writing as “crazy fangirls” overreacting
And this is only just the tip of the iceberg.
Yikes at that webcomic. I must have a terrible sense of humor because I didn’t find it funny.
zuzusexytiems, to answer your question about ‘defensiveness,’ I was hinting at some interview comments given over the years.
For example, look at the way they’ve rudely gone after those who identify themselves as Zutarians. If they really were happy with the way Kataang was executed, they wouldn’t be making these passive-aggressive jabs over the years (like the one asking about the ATLA characters making a cameo in LoK: how on earth did they get ‘Zutara diss’ out of that?) that only serves to fracture their fan base. I just think as a writer, no matter how you secretly feel about a pairing, the last thing you should do is insult those paying your bills.
Hell, if I was a writer on a popular series, I’d have fun with all of the non-canon ships and enjoy the fact people are that enthusiastic about my work. I just don’t think its necessary to engage in the above behavior like that, especially from a professional standard.
Considering a large portion of the fandom was teenage girls back when the show was on (it still might be) that’s really not a good look. Imagine being 10 or 11 and having your show’s creators make fun of you. You have to think about the message you are putting out there.
The only other thing I have to add in conjunction with the above (nicely done, kataraandzuko!) is the mess known as the ‘Korrasami tumblr’ post. The tone and word use in the post just screams as someone on the defensive needing to ridicule anyone in the fanbase who dares question the haphazard nature of a poorly developed ship. If you have to insult someone instead of providing anecdotal evidence in your debate, how strong is your argument, really?
If you’re confident in your work and know you’ve done a good job, you wouldn’t be protesting about it on tumblr of all places. Its not good either to project false attributes (i.e., heteronormative lens) onto your fans either. Nothing personal against Bryke, but that was in extremely poor form and not a good move.
And on a random note, I don’t think they needed to bash Aang (he did not deserve that!) in order to build Korra up. His relationship with Appa was extremely important and the only remaining part of his past, so of course he was devastated about it. That ‘rampage’ wasn’t a very good example either, comparing apples and oranges.
That moment when you realize that a lot of what you enjoyed about a show probably came from the writers rather than its creator(s).
